liver shunt (again sorry!!)

[paddyjulie]

hi

Just a couple of questions if you dont mind, i have tried searching but have not come across the answers to my question..

my Dog Ozzy an english bullterrier has just been diagnosed with a liver shunt he is two years old, i have been advised to feed him royal canin hepatic by the vet which is what i am now doing, previous to this i was feed him a natural diet of raw meat and vegetable..
for a long time now he has drank excessivley and urinated a lot..he often has a vacant look and is often shaking, very tired , eats dog poo???,and is very agressive to some dogs

How many times a day should i be feeding him is small but often best, or does it not matter?

also

for the last 9 month he has has sores on both tips of his ears, they will not heal up, they scab over with a black bloody colour scab, the scab falls off and it then bleeds again, we have tried various creams from the vet but nothing helps, could the liver shunt be causing this?

the vet has told me that they would not be able to operate on him as it would be a very risky operation because of his size ?

will this cut his life short?

Juliex

[Ellie May]

4-6 small meals a day is best.
If there is any problem with stones, he may need water added to his kibble (equal parts water to kibble). I have no idea what the ear problem might be, but liver shunt can weaken their immune system.

How much does he weigh?
What tests have been done?
Have you seen an internist?
Is he on SAMe, milk thistle and lactulose?

[Yorkiedaze]

You really need to get a couple more opinions. His immune system is greatly compromised and is why he isn't healing properly. Surgery now would be very dangerous. You really need to put him back on real food and give him good vitamins. I don't know how much your dog weighs, but dogs as small as 2 pounds have had liver shunt surgery and done just fine. Call this office and let them direct you to the best surgeon in your area.

MSPCA-Angell: Surgery Homepage

[paddyjulie]

Hi Ozzy weighs 30kg
i took him to the vets originally for a upc test as i was worried he had kidney disease this came back fine, his urine was very couloured and smelly(he has always excessivly urinated and drank water)
I then took him back to the vets as i was still concerned about him as i knew he was just 'not right' i asked for blood test to be done, they came back as a high bile acid, high potassium , and one slightly dehydrated kidney..we then had further test for Addisons Disease which came back ok, next was a bile acid test which was high.
i am so worried about him at the moment a good while back he was such a strapping lad, now he has no life in him, if he does have the odd play with Mavis my other bullie he is tired out for the rest of the day

The vet has told me to feed him this food and to touch base with her in a few weeks to see how he is getting on,
his vaccines are due the end of this month do we give him them or not ,
totally confused to be honest by the whole thing

juliex

I am in the uk

[Ellie May]

Originally Posted by paddyjulie

Hi Ozzy weighs 30kg
i took him to the vets originally for a upc test as i was worried he had kidney disease this came back fine, his urine was very couloured and smelly(he has always excessivly urinated and drank water)
I then took him back to the vets as i was still concerned about him as i knew he was just 'not right' i asked for blood test to be done, they came back as a high bile acid, high potassium , and one slightly dehydrated kidney..we then had further test for Addisons Disease which came back ok, next was a bile acid test which was high.
i am so worried about him at the moment a good while back he was such a strapping lad, now he has no life in him, if he does have the odd play with Mavis my other bullie he is tired out for the rest of the day

The vet has told me to feed him this food and to touch base with her in a few weeks to see how he is getting on,
his vaccines are due the end of this month do we give him them or not ,
totally confused to be honest by the whole thing

juliex

I am in the uk

I don't know the laws on vaccines there, but in general when a dog is this sick, no you do not give them.

If you want him to be as normal as possible, he is going to need to be pu on SAMe (Denosyl or Denestra) and a couple other things immediately.

[Yorkiedaze]

Originally Posted by paddyjulie

Hi Ozzy weighs 30kg
i took him to the vets originally for a upc test as i was worried he had kidney disease this came back fine, his urine was very couloured and smelly(he has always excessivly urinated and drank water)
I then took him back to the vets as i was still concerned about him as i knew he was just 'not right' i asked for blood test to be done, they came back as a high bile acid, high potassium , and one slightly dehydrated kidney..we then had further test for Addisons Disease which came back ok, next was a bile acid test which was high.
i am so worried about him at the moment a good while back he was such a strapping lad, now he has no life in him, if he does have the odd play with Mavis my other bullie he is tired out for the rest of the day

The vet has told me to feed him this food and to touch base with her in a few weeks to see how he is getting on,
his vaccines are due the end of this month do we give him them or not ,
totally confused to be honest by the whole thing

juliex

I am in the uk

OMG, NO, NO, NO vaccines. Hon, you really do need to change your Vet. before she kills your dog. I'm so very sorry to be so blunt, but you really do need to find a specialist and I pray you call the number I gave you. You really need to act ASAP and get him into the right Dr. right away, and not be on YT trying to get such critical information. Please, call that number and find the right surgeon now!

[paddyjulie]

Originally Posted by Yorkiedaze

OMG, NO, NO, NO vaccines. Hon, you really do need to change your Vet. before she kills your dog. I'm so very sorry to be so blunt, but you really do need to find a specialist and I pray you call the number I gave you. You really need to act ASAP and get him into the right Dr. right away, and not be on YT trying to get such critical information. Please, call that number and find the right surgeon now!

Hi thanks for that i will go back to the vet and try and see what i can do.i am from England so i am not sure if that number would be able to help me..

Thanks again


juliex

[paddyjulie]

Originally Posted by Yorkiedaze

OMG, NO, NO, NO vaccines. Hon, you really do need to change your Vet. before she kills your dog. I'm so very sorry to be so blunt, but you really do need to find a specialist and I pray you call the number I gave you. You really need to act ASAP and get him into the right Dr. right away, and not be on YT trying to get such critical information. Please, call that number and find the right surgeon now!

Yorkiedaze thanks very much, i will go back to the vets , i don't think the number will be able to help as i am from the United kingdom, if i get no further on wth our present vet i will phone around other vets in our area(lake district) to see if they have any experience with liver shunts in large dogs

Thanks again

Juliex

[TLC]

Please join this yahoo group:

DogLiverDisease : Dog Liver Disease

The members there are very helpful and there are a number of different breeds there as well that also have liver shunts.

The RC kibble is the correct food. You can also use Hill l/d (wet) food, which has more moisture content. You may need to add some water the RC kibble if he is having urine issues. Did they check for stones or crystals in his urine?

What was his Bile Acid results?

[paddyjulie]

Originally Posted by TLC

Please join this yahoo group:

DogLiverDisease : Dog Liver Disease

The members there are very helpful and there are a number of different breeds there as well that also have liver shunts.

The RC kibble is the correct food. You can also use Hill l/d (wet) food, which has more moisture content. You may need to add some water the RC kibble if he is having urine issues. Did they check for stones or crystals in his urine?

What was his Bile Acid results?

thanx for that. i will get the results off the vet next time i go..there was no check for stones or crystals...i will ask for this check when i go ...he has had the urine problem since he was a pup...we let him out for a wee at say midnight i have to get up at about 6 in the morning again for him as he can not go any longer ..he also suffered with colitis(sp?) as a pup that is one of the reasons i put him on the raw diet,,this improved a lot with this type of feeding, he would poo!! about 4-5 times a day on kibble (james wellbeloved and also royal canin)

juliex

[Yorkiedaze]

Originally Posted by paddyjulie

Hi thanks for that i will go back to the vet and try and see what i can do.i am from England so i am not sure if that number would be able to help me..

Thanks again


juliex

They do referrel's world wide. If you like, I can call my girls orthopedic surgeon who teaches world wide if he knows of a good surgeon in your area. Just pm me and let me know what town your in or near and I'll ask him. Unless you would rather talk to him yourself. Just let me know.

[paddyjulie]

Hi

have not had much time to get back on here as i am back at work..Paddy my husband had to take him back to the vets this morning as he had taken a turn for the worst and was falling over....the vet has now given us a lactulose solution to help him get rid of the toxins that are in his gut... i have also joined the yahoo group and they have been so helpfull in this short time, from Ozzy's bile test results they have said that it looks like he has multiple internal shunts and are more than likely unoperable...the group is brilliant and have helped me a lot in the short Hours i have been a member about food etc

Thanks

juliex

[TLC]

Originally Posted by paddyjulie

Hi

have not had much time to get back on here as i am back at work..Paddy my husband had to take him back to the vets this morning as he had taken a turn for the worst and was falling over....the vet has now given us a lactulose solution to help him get rid of the toxins that are in his gut... i have also joined the yahoo group and they have been so helpfull in this short time, from Ozzy's bile test results they have said that it looks like he has multiple internal shunts and are more than likely unoperable...the group is brilliant and have helped me a lot in the short Hours i have been a member about food etc

Thanks

juliex

I am so glad you joined the group. They are AMAZING. So helpful, and so full of Liver Shunt knowledge and experience. I know they will help guide you to care for Ozzy the best way possible

[Robin Lodal]

Originally Posted by TLC

I am so glad you joined the group. They are AMAZING. So helpful, and so full of Liver Shunt knowledge and experience. I know they will help guide you to care for Ozzy the best way possible

I agree! I joined the group very recently and I have learned a lot as well. I saw that you had posted there before I saw your post on YT. I hope your boy can over come this and you are able to find right doctors for him.

[paddyjulie]

Thankyou so much for directing me towards this group..i have been really upset tonight because of Ozzy and his problems and they have helped me so much..he is now fast asleep on my knee after eating a little pasta with his lactulose mixed in....fingers crossed it stays down

juliex