hitting with newspaper???

[Rae Rae]

Originally Posted by Annie&Badger

100% ^

I can't believe that anyone would advise smacking a dog, or a child for that matter (for what it's worth, my mother used to give me the odd disciplinary 'tap' which resulted in my being hospitalised on two separate occasions. So please don't even bother telling me that's an effective way to get any kind of result)

Dogs only live to do one thing: make you happy. If you understand that, you're all the way to getting them to do whatever you want. If Badger does something I don't want him to do, I just say "No" in a firm voice. As soon as he stops doing it (and it must be immediately), I go "Good boy! Mummy's Angel! Good Boy!". That way he knows immediately what is expected of him and he's only too delighted to carry on doing the 'right' thing. Sure he has the odd 'mistake' or 'accident' but don't we all

Violence begets violence and nothing else

I'm sorry to hear that your mom ended up putting you in the hospital...now that is whats called abuse, and was not a tap. What you have to undrstand though is that not everyone who "taps" their children and/or dogs are putting them in the hospital, leaving bruises or even redmarks, and not leaving emotional scars. I was spanked as a child, not abused and I'm not scarred from it. So from your case, it might not have been effective. I'm a firm believer that there are acceptions and each case is different, therefore I'm not going to say "well this works for me so it works for everyone, etc." because I know things aren't like that.

And your lucky your dog listens when you say "NO" in a firm voice. Mine on the other hand will completely ignore the command.


For everyone else:
Anyways, I'm done with all this. Alls I want to say is that, in a PM someone told me it sounded like I smack my dog for everything, which I don't. I don't need to sit here and say why I smack my dog, cuz frankly it's no ones business. I know I'm not a dog abuser, but you guys make it sound like it's soo wrong to hit a dog for ANY reason, but tell me, if a dog tried to attack another human being would you not hit it? Would you just say "NO?" and when it stops say "Good boy?" I highly doubt it, and if you would, you have issues. So like I said before Im not telling anyone how to raise their dog, so please give me that same respect. I have never seen people get so upset over something that they really don't know anything about (the situation with my dog) and be so harsh. So like I said before, can't we just agree to disagree?

[chachi]

Certain subjects get very strong opinions and spanking a dog is one of those subjects. I dont agree with spanking a dog because I did it wth Chachi and he started flinching. I do know other people who do it though and their dogs are unaffected. I am sorry someone pmed you they really should not have done that.

[sylvan]

Originally Posted by Rae Rae

Think of it this way. Have you ever had a dog that attacks people..we don't want to risk him biting anyone, and don't want to put him down. When you have a vicious dog and take him to the training and you are told by the trainer to always keep it on him, along w/ a choker chain, you might have a different opinion on this. I always thought the pronged ones were harsh too, until I got this dog and we did our research on it.

Did you train this vicious dog from the time he was a pup? I know you had stated that he was bred from a dog with a bad temperment and so it was 'in the blood'...but inherited temperment only goes so far....that sort of behavior and the running away instead of coming when called can be addressed and managed by using positive training methods that would probably give you much better results than the ones you are dealing with right now. If you could stop being so defensive about the way you have been doing this and perhaps find a trainer that would not suggest using the antiquated methods you have been attempting thus far, you may be pleasantly rewarded with an animal that would not be a hazard to visitors and actually come when called.
jmo

[Rae Rae]

Originally Posted by sylvan

Did you train this vicious dog from the time he was a pup? I know you had stated that he was bred from a dog with a bad temperment and so it was 'in the blood'...but inherited temperment only goes so far....that sort of behavior and the running away instead of coming when called can be addressed and managed by using positive training methods that would probably give you much better results than the ones you are dealing with right now. If you could stop being so defensive about the way you have been doing this and perhaps find a trainer that would not suggest using the antiquated methods you have been attempting thus far, you may be pleasantly rewarded with an animal that would not be a hazard to visitors and actually come when called.
jmo

You're telling me that inherited tempermant only goes so far, and I'm not trying to say your wrong or insult you, but from an animal trainer we were told the exact opposite, therefore I think in this case it's best to be safe and go w/ that. Also think of it this way, and please don't take offense, but I don't know who you are and how credible you are with animals, other people can vouch for you, but this is what we were informed from a licensed animal trainer. Yeah Gizmo (my dog) can be fine, trained to the T and get all A+'s on it. But he still has this "gene" or whatever you want to call it in him, therefore one day out of the blue (like how it always happens) he can snap, and if we dont take proper precautions, it WILL happen.

And do you NOT think we never used positive methods? I'm not getting defensive, and if you take it that way I apologize. I am getting aggrivated though because no one on here knows what my dog is like, and therefore really cannot judge. I just don't appreciated people acting like I'm a bad owner when I have never in my life heard any reactions like the ones on here from how I treat my dog. Obviously we all have different views and ways of thinking, so thats why it gets to the point that none of you on here know my dog or know what he is like, so before you judge, sit in a room with him and pet him and see how long you last from him not listening to you and before he tries to bite you.

Oh, and Gizmo always comes when called, unless he's playing tag around the neighborhood, which once again he can't do because he can't be trusted around people.

And as for finding another trainer, we have had numerous professional opinions and have taken him to a few different trainers.

Edit: I also want to let you know that the dog is trained, trust me. He knows how to do all his commands and even tricks. He knows how to be a good boy. That is why we know he is trained and this is just him being stubborn and disobeying. When he wants to, he can be the best dog ever, actually to me right now he is one of the best dogs ever, but that's just cuz he's my baby and I love him

[vainchick5]

Originally Posted by sylvan

Did you train this vicious dog from the time he was a pup? I know you had stated that he was bred from a dog with a bad temperment and so it was 'in the blood'...but inherited temperment only goes so far....that sort of behavior and the running away instead of coming when called can be addressed and managed by using positive training methods that would probably give you much better results than the ones you are dealing with right now. If you could stop being so defensive about the way you have been doing this and perhaps find a trainer that would not suggest using the antiquated methods you have been attempting thus far, you may be pleasantly rewarded with an animal that would not be a hazard to visitors and actually come when called.
jmo

Once again you give excellent advice For those that care to have a well behaved dog anyway. If they don't then they can deal with an unruly dog and wonder where they went wrong

[Rae Rae]

Originally Posted by vainchick5

Once again you give excellent advice For those that care to have a well behaved dog anyway. If they don't then they can deal with an unruly dog and wonder where they went wrong

Have you ever had a vicious dog that IS trained and will be fine one minute while someone is petting him and then for no reason tries to bite them?

[sylvan]

a well trained dog will not bite for no reason under any circumstances.

[browniesmom622]

Originally Posted by Rae Rae

Have you ever had a vicious dog that IS trained and will be fine one minute while someone is petting him and then for no reason tries to bite them?

i think this thread needs to get back to the original poster

[BamaFan121s]

Originally Posted by Rae Rae

Have you ever had a vicious dog that IS trained and will be fine one minute while someone is petting him and then for no reason tries to bite them?

I have. He was actually very calm and loving MOST of the time. But as we found out, the problem was not from lack of training, an inherited gene, or neglect/abuse of the animal on our part--it was actually caused by a severe neurological problem. Have you ever had the dog examined to rule out this scenario? Just a suggestion.

Also, not to stir the pot, but Stacy did bring up a very valid point. And not to say that you DIDN'T do this, but...Yes, inherited behavior can play a big role, but so can proper training from an early age on. And sorry, but you don't need a licensed anyone to tell you that...it's common sense.

I hope you get help with your little one. I know how frustrating and heartbreaking a situation like this is. Please do keep us posted.

[kaymo]

Rae Rae you also mentioned that you put your dog in his crate when he runs off and comes back. You do realize that crates are not to be used for discipline right? Maybe you should seriously think about getting a new trainer. I say this in all sincerity because there are some very well respected people on this thread with excellent credentials as well as some famous pet behaviorist/trainers who are giving the opposite advice than what you were given. Please please for the sake of your pets and you consider getting a new trainer.

[JCarlson2004]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

I have. He was actually very calm and loving MOST of the time. But as we found out, the problem was not from lack of training, an inherited gene, or neglect/abuse of the animal on our part--it was actually caused by a severe neurological problem. Have you ever had the dog examined to rule out this scenario? Just a suggestion.

Also, not to stir the pot, but Stacy did bring up a very valid point. And not to say that you DIDN'T do this, but...Yes, inherited behavior can play a big role, but so can proper training from an early age on. And sorry, but you don't need a licensed anyone to tell you that...it's common sense.

I hope you get help with your little one. I know how frustrating and heartbreaking a situation like this is. Please do keep us posted.

Well said.

[Yorkease]

I just wanted to add my personal experience.

I treat my dogs like puppies with short memory , if they have an accident, I clean it up and take them and the "accident to the piddle pad or outside". Then we praise them and they seem to look at us for praise when they do hit the piddle pad. This lets them know the right spot to "go". I do this with my child too, not pooping but if he does something wrong I tell him what is wrong about it and tell him the right way to do it next time.
I will tell you all a funny story about Hercules, my big yorkie. He thinks is he puts his front feet on the pad that he is automatically going to hit the pad, but he doesn't. LOL! I don't scream and yell at him because he tried. I just get my mop bucket and cleaner and clean it up.
Regarding hitting: I think they are too fragile, I just don't do it.

[Susanbee51]

Originally Posted by Rae Rae

I don't think theres anything wrong w/ swatting the dog w/ the paper. We do it to our dogs when they do something that they know is wrong. As for pottying in the house though, I wouldn't do it. You have to show them what they did wrong (stick their nose right up to it) and tell them no, or tap them. Like when my dog pushes his luck and goes into the garbage can after we tell him NO repeativly, of course were going to spank him. Just don't do it too hard. But you have nothing to feel bad about.

Edit: As for tapping their nose, I'm talking about when the dog is older and has been potty trained, and just goes in the house for no reason. Definitly not during potty training time though!

I have a six year old, 6 lb female yorkie. Ooops, front paws on pee pad, and potty's on the floor, hit or swat her, NOT!! Ooops, does not bark to go outside to potty and pees at the back door, hit or swat her, NOT! Ooops when in heat, she seems to have a weaker bladder. She goes potty on the floor away from her pee pad, hit or swat her, NOT. Ooops, I am gone too long and she goes potty, and not on the pee pad, hit or swat her, NOT!! Would I tap her on the nose because of any of these incidents? NEVER! NEVER! NEVER!

[JCarlson2004]

Originally Posted by Susanbee51

I have a six year old, 6 lb female yorkie. Ooops, front paws on pee pad, and potty's on the floor, hit or swat her, NOT!! Ooops, does not bark to go outside to potty and pees at the back door, hit or swat her, NOT! Ooops when in heat, she seems to have a weaker bladder. She goes potty on the floor away from her pee pad, hit or swat her, NOT. Ooops, I am gone too long and she goes potty, and not on the pee pad, hit or swat her, NOT!! Would I tap her on the nose because of any of these incidents? NEVER! NEVER! NEVER!

I couldn't agree with you more.

[Rae Rae]

Originally Posted by BamaFan121s

I have. He was actually very calm and loving MOST of the time. But as we found out, the problem was not from lack of training, an inherited gene, or neglect/abuse of the animal on our part--it was actually caused by a severe neurological problem. Have you ever had the dog examined to rule out this scenario? Just a suggestion.

Also, not to stir the pot, but Stacy did bring up a very valid point. And not to say that you DIDN'T do this, but...Yes, inherited behavior can play a big role, but so can proper training from an early age on. And sorry, but you don't need a licensed anyone to tell you that...it's common sense.

I hope you get help with your little one. I know how frustrating and heartbreaking a situation like this is. Please do keep us posted.

By examined to you mean like his brain? We've come to this conclusion about him because he has been through all the training programs and still snaps, has all the signs of a vicious dog (chasing wheels, i forgot the rest) and we found out a few months ago his mom was a biter, so everything points to that conclusion.

As for the "proper training" to correct his behavior, like I said, he's a well behaved dog, but only when he wants to be. And no matter how much training he goes through (if he can even go through anymore), is it really worth risking leaving him alone with someone who he might bite? I don't think it is, other people might risk it, but my family doesn't need to be worried about getting sued and losing their house as a result of it. Now that's common sense to me. And with that risk being a huge factor, I wouldnt trust just anybody if they tell me that he's trained so he will be fine. It's obviously not worth it. Another thing is, if he was able to be "trained" to get out of this behavior, my mom wouldn't have been soo close to putting him down (we changed her mine the day that she was going to take him). She didnt want to put him down, she was bawling her eyes out, she obviously tried all the solutions. So trust me, if my mom couldnt get him better, there really is no chance, except the dog psych. which were going to try, but this isn't exactly how you "properly train" a dog, so that is why I'm saying proper training doesnt really make a difference when the dog has it in his blood, his natural instincts, to bite.

Anyways, someone on here taught me about a trick w/ holding the dog down to help w/ his dominating personality, so next time I see him I am going to try that. W/ my dog it probably won't work, but I'm atleast going to give it a shot cuz theirs really nothing to lose. I'll let you know though if things get better

One more thing, you called him little one...he's 70lbs!!! LOL