Calling all Detectives lol

[yorkie_mama22]

I am not that great with searching online for info and I know we have some people who are good at finding info out about breeders and such. Well tonight I can't get my baby Stormy out of my head! For some reason I just want to see if there is anything out there that I can read about where my baby came from. The breeders name was Mariam Zimmerman, I know they had to be puppymillers, she told me they sold to pet stores and were regularely inspected. I wish I knew all this before I got my baby but I didn't know nothing since she was a rehome. I want to see if there is anything bad out there about them, other people who have dealt with them, anything. I know they live in Versailles Missouri and they are menoites. She said they bred a few different breeds, I know shihtzus and yorkies for sure. I miss her so much! I just can't forget her or get her out of my head. I am beating myself up right now wishing I would of went ahead and had her body examined after she passed.

[yorkiehugs]

I'm sooo sorry for you lost.

Try this one

http://www.prisonersofgreed.org/ListA2006.pdf

There is another, let me find it. If I can.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by yorkie_mama22

I am not that great with searching online for info and I know we have some people who are good at finding info out about breeders and such. Well tonight I can't get my baby Stormy out of my head! For some reason I just want to see if there is anything out there that I can read about where my baby came from. The breeders name was Mariam Zimmerman, I know they had to be puppymillers, she told me they sold to pet stores and were regularely inspected. I wish I knew all this before I got my baby but I didn't know nothing since she was a rehome. I want to see if there is anything bad out there about them, other people who have dealt with them, anything. I know they live in Versailles Missouri and they are menoites. She said they bred a few different breeds, I know shihtzus and yorkies for sure. I miss her so much! I just can't forget her or get her out of my head. I am beating myself up right now wishing I would of went ahead and had her body examined after she passed.

What do you mean, you wish you would have gotten the body examined?

[Ladymom]

Originally Posted by yorkiehugs

I'm sooo sorry for you lost.

Try this one

http://www.prisonersofgreed.org/ListA2006.pdf

There is another, let me find it. If I can.

Yes, Stormy's breeder is on the USDA "puppymill" list.

When you say you wish you had Stormy's body examined after she died, I assume you mean a necropsy. I thought Stormy was killed by your other dog?

[yorkie_mama22]

Originally Posted by Ladymom

Yes, Stormy's breeder is on the USDA "puppymill" list.

When you say you wish you had Stormy's body examined after she died, I assume you mean a necropsy. I thought Stormy was killed by your other dog?

I assumed that my other dog "killed" her because when I got home I didn't know what else to think. It made sense that maybe my other dog hurt her some how but after actually speaking with my fiancee about what happen from when he heard her yelp to her passing it just has been bothering me alot and doesn't make sense. I mean it is possible that is what happen but the way he says she yelped, then was unresponsive on the floor, limp and starring straight into the air is all the exact same as how she was when she had seizures before. It didn't cross my mind at that time because it had been months since she had one. I was in shock and I was always worrying about her and keeping her safe, I didn't let her go for walks for too long or let my other dog bother her because I didn't ever want to stress her or anything. So the only thing I thought was maybe my other dog hurt her because I wasn't there to protect her. After I rushed home to find her "gone" my mother was with me and took her to be buried, I didn't think to bring her to get the necrospy. But now I really wish I had done it to make sure and be positive. I know it is too late now but I just am not convinced my other dog did anything to her. Who knows I guess. I am just really missng her and still hurting so much. I remember her first seizures where about two or so weeks after we got her and she was stressed from being at a new place, I was working all day and after I got home she had one and then another, her seizures were really bad but we got her breathing with CPR. She was so dopey afterwards and the vet never did figure out what caused them. After that I was laid off and I had been home with her always until I started working again. But she died on a Monday, I was gone to work Friday, Sat and Sunday 12 hours each, and I usually brought her in with me to the office but those days I didn't because my daughter was crying for me to leave her at home so I did. On Monday I was home for a couple hours in the morning but didn't pay too much attention to her, I did cuddle her on the couch for an hour but I had to go bring my car in to get fixed and I was gone for 5 hours. Maybe she was stressed that I was gone and thought I was abandoning her? Maybe she thought I was not coming back and she had a seizure and I wasn't there to do anything for her. My fiancee did what he could I know but he was in a panic and my daughter was here too, he had no car to rush her in he called me but I thought it was a sick joke or something, I rushed home and it was too late, I took about 15-20 mins to get home, he was giving her CPR but she was already passed when I got home
I guess I just keep being bothered by this, I just don't understand how my other dog may of killed her so quick ? It didn't feel like she had any broken bones or anything so I just don't know. I don't want to make excuses for my other dog because it may of just been a freak accident but I just don't know.

[Nancy1999]

Some breeds can snap a small dog's neck pretty easily, I hope your not saying that Stormy may have just been unconscious, where did your mother take her? It might be a good idea to have some type of back up plan in place if your boyfriend doesn't have a car. Getting to know neighbors, or calling a cab might help if your new dog ever needs emergency treatment. If Stormy was prone to seizures this would be another reason, to not allow her to interact with certain dogs, but I don't think you can really blame the breeder for most of Stormy's problems.

[chandracz]

I'm sorry you're still grieving so bad about little Stormy!!!

[RachelandSadie]

i don't trust that list, i see someone i know very very well from my hometown area's name on that list and i GUARANTEE does not run any sort of puppy mill and as far as i know has never raised puppies and if they did it was her ex husband not her, but her name is listed and she's been divorced from him for YEARS. i think it's a little outdated and inaccurate. not every single breeder that has multiple breeds of dogs or raises them in a nice outside kennel is a puppy mill by default...does this list actually have proof that they were checked out and that the place was overrun with multiple dogs and messy nasty poor conditions or do they just list people that don't raise one breed in the house with them all the time???????

just curious because Heather Tharp from Bethany, MO...aka Heather Querry is NOT a puppy miller, she doesn't even have puppies

[bchgirl]

That list is outdated....here's an updated list.

http://www.aphis.usda.gov/animal_wel...rt_holders.txt

Not every USDA licensed breeder means they breed puppies...breeders of ferrets and other small rodents are also USDA licensed.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by RachelandSadie

i don't trust that list, i see someone i know very very well from my hometown area's name on that list and i GUARANTEE does not run any sort of puppy mill and as far as i know has never raised puppies and if they did it was her ex husband not her, but her name is listed and she's been divorced from him for YEARS. i think it's a little outdated and inaccurate. not every single breeder that has multiple breeds of dogs or raises them in a nice outside kennel is a puppy mill by default...does this list actually have proof that they were checked out and that the place was overrun with multiple dogs and messy nasty poor conditions or do they just list people that don't raise one breed in the house with them all the time???????

just curious because Heather Tharp from Bethany, MO...aka Heather Querry is NOT a puppy miller, she doesn't even have puppies

While not every commercial kennel is a puppy mill breeder, the vast majority are, and that is why everyone who buys from a commercial breeder should insist upon seeing the kennels. Otherwise, you are condoning the torture of innocent dogs.

[RachelandSadie]

gottcha!! i'm glad my breeder wasn't on that list, he checked out pretty well i'd say especially with how good little Sadie is doing!

[yorkie_mama22]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

Some breeds can snap a small dog's neck pretty easily, I hope your not saying that Stormy may have just been unconscious, where did your mother take her? It might be a good idea to have some type of back up plan in place if your boyfriend doesn't have a car. Getting to know neighbors, or calling a cab might help if your new dog ever needs emergency treatment. If Stormy was prone to seizures this would be another reason, to not allow her to interact with certain dogs, but I don't think you can really blame the breeder for most of Stormy's problems.

No I never said she was unconscious, I said she was gone when I got home. I don't think her neck was snapped, like I mentioned you couldn't feel any broken bones and I'm sure a broken neck would stand out, she was simply laying on her side. I don't see how a dog who is prone to seizures shouldn't be allowed around certain dogs, that doesn't make sense unless you mean perhaps another dog could scare a dog into a seizure. I don't know if she was prone to them, I just said she had had a few in the past and was fine for a while therefore it had slipped my mind as a possible reason for her death. No I can't blame ALL of her issues on the breeder but most like her LP and seizures obviously were the breeders fault as well as her having issues with her eyes may of been genetic too. Who knows what else may of been an issue. If she was from a puppymill which she was, she wasn't bred properly is what I am saying.

[bchgirl]

While seizures are signs of genetic health issue...it would've been your responsibility to get a diagnosis and if you wanted to hold the breeder responsible...a necropsy should've been performed. Even the most reputable breeder on the planet would've have had that stipulation in a contract.

[Nancy1999]

Originally Posted by RachelandSadie

gottcha!! i'm glad my breeder wasn't on that list, he checked out pretty well i'd say especially with how good little Sadie is doing!

Don't forget that that many states don't even require breeders to be on the list, this is especially true of States like Missouri, and believe me when I say that in those states being on this list is a badge of honor, because at least they have passed some sort of inspection. The ONLY way to insure you are not rewarding those who make their living from the inhumane conditions of dogs is to see the kennels yourself. In other words you become the inspector, and if it passes your tests, then you can support the breeder.

[yorkie_mama22]

Originally Posted by Nancy1999

While not every commercial kennel is a puppy mill breeder, the vast majority are, and that is why everyone who buys from a commercial breeder should insist upon seeing the kennels. Otherwise, you are condoning the torture of innocent dogs.

That is contradicting what you said to me that I can't blame Stormy's problems on the breeder, but yet you say that commerical breeders torture innocent dogs. So why can't I blame them for the problems my baby had? I know she had one issue which was NOT their fault but besides that the other problems she had I can blame them for. Her emotional issues were someone elses problem but her being properly bred was their fault. Even when I found out that they were a puppymill when I called the lady she even offered to give me a new dog to replace the problems I was having with Stormy, I said no thanks! If she didn't feel at fault she wouldn't of offered a new dog.